What’s in this Episode?

Church Fuel CEO, Ryan Wakefield, and Leaders.Church Co-Founder, Dick Hardy, dialogue on what pastors and church leaders should focus on as they head into the holidays. Their major focus is not only on Christmas invites but even MORE on getting those December guests to return for whatever you have planned for January.

Ryan is also giving away three high-value Church Fuel resources to any podcast viewer or listener who wants them. This is one of the best podcasts we’ve ever done with a theme of how we can make heaven more crowded.

Start a free Test Drive with Church Fuel to get access to the New Beginning Kit

Get help with planning Christmas with our Ultimate Christmas Kit

Here is the 10 Ideas PDF to get your people to fill out your Connect Card

 

Read the Transcript:

Dick Hardy 0:06
Hey friends, welcome to the Church Tips Podcast. I am so excited to have you here today, and I’m really excited to have a buddy of mine, Ryan Wakefield, from the great state of Missouri and Kansas City Chiefs fan.

Ryan Wakefield 0:18
Let’s go Chiefs!

Dick Hardy 0:19
So, say hi to everybody, Ryan.

Ryan Wakefield 0:21
It’s great to be here. Yep, coming from Kansas City, and hopefully the Chiefs can redeem this season. Moved up here in 2013 with the family to help start a church. It’s been a blast ever since.

Ryan Wakefield 0:32
Royals got a World Series. Chiefs got a few Super Bowls, and absolutely loving Kansas City.

Dick Hardy 0:37
That is great. Well, today we want to jump into the conversation about guests as we’re heading up in through the holidays, and churches go hog wild trying to get everybody to their Christmas programs and Christmas Eve services and so on and so on and so on.

Dick Hardy 0:57
But then January comes. And so, Ryan is the CEO of ChurchFuel, and he’s done a masterful job on really creating value for pastors and church leaders in the area of visitors and visitor follow up. So Ryan, give us a little jump start on what you’re thinking here as you’re headed into into Christmas.

Ryan Wakefield 1:19
Yeah, pastors and church leaders know you got a couple big momentum seasons every year, Easter, Christmas, and oftentimes we’re all high fiving, and then the week after or the month after it happens, and we’re like, where did all those visitors go?

Ryan Wakefield 1:33
And then sometimes we find ourselves complaining of like, why do only people come out on Christmas and Easter? And so, Dick, I thought we could just have a conversation around tips to help churches not just create two spikes and then flat line again.

Ryan Wakefield 1:47
How do we use Christmas? Because here’s the good news, you’ve got natural momentum with visitors. They’re going to be coming and families, hopefully, and we can help you get strategies and get invites out. But more importantly, for this episode, how do we make sure we are dialed in to get them to come back in January?

Ryan Wakefield 2:04
Because it’s great to get get a visitor, but our commission is to get believers and followers of Jesus and disciples, right? And so I want you to start thinking about and Dick. This would be my point number one. When you’re trying to think about Christmas, don’t start with planning Christmas, actually start by planning January, and then rally the team that our goal this Christmas season is a little bit different.

Ryan Wakefield 2:27
Our whole goal in December is to build attendance for January. That’s how we know we’ve done a good job this Christmas is that families come back in January. So get everybody on that one goal, center everything around that one goal. And then when you start to plan December, make sure everything aligns with that goal.

Ryan Wakefield 2:46
And then I think you’ll find that Christmas becomes what it should be, a springboard into your next year. And then you could hopefully build on that momentum through Easter and all year round. So that that’s what I’d love to just kind of Dick, have a conversation with you of. As pastors, how do we, how do we plan for that? How we, how do we look at Christmas a little bit different?

Dick Hardy 3:07
You know, I and I think one of the things a large portion of this audience is in the United States, Canada, in Western cultures. Where it is we are so blessed that it is a natural even if you’re talking to a heathen, someone who is clueless about God, there’s an understanding of Christmas.

Dick Hardy 3:29
So it’s a natural time for people to be able to be inviting their friends to Christmas, and it’s incumbent upon us, as you just said, Ryan to be prepared then for January. I love, I don’t know if you use the term, but it’s almost like going to the end of January and working it backwards.

Ryan Wakefield 3:48
Yep.

Dick Hardy 3:49
Because that’s that’s really what you need to be doing. I remember little side note. I remember, on Easters, the greatest day in the in the entire calendar to call a pastor is what day it’s the Monday after Easter. They’re all flying high. They’re loving life. And you’d have the same thing with Christmas, you know?

Dick Hardy 4:10
And the worst day to call a pastor is on the Monday after the Sunday after Easter. Where did everybody go? So every one of you listening to this know exactly what Ryan was talking about. It’s January. It’s not December. It’s January is our focus, and to the extent that you can do that, you’re going to see different and better results this year than you’ve ever had.

Ryan Wakefield 4:36
Yeah, and let’s real quick give them a couple tips, because when you’re looking at January, that’s what’s great about this plan is January is another natural momentum season where families are wanting to get you know the year started with healthy habits. They say, oh we should have our kids in church. We know we want to have a different approach this year. We want to be better this year.

Ryan Wakefield 4:58
And so your your families are naturally moving in that direction. And so if you can start by planning, and I’d love, Dick to give your whole audience, we have a whole kit called A New Beginning that just helps a church do a sermon series around the concept of, like, a new start, a fresh start.

Ryan Wakefield 5:14
And so we can, we can just bless for any pastor that maybe is at a normal size church. And like Ryan, we don’t have a whole lot of resources. Hey, We’ll bless you. We’ll give you that kit.

Ryan Wakefield 5:22
And you can do something like that, a series that kicks off the year, and then all December, you’re inviting people. And what’s some pastors you know will lean into like a challenge, Hey, be sure that your family starts the next year off in church, right?

Ryan Wakefield 5:38
And we’re going to be kicking off a new series. And so get something exciting happening in the month of January that you’re promoting all December long, so that every time you’re bumping into guests and visitors and families coming in the one of the very first thing that you’re doing is inviting them to January.

Ryan Wakefield 5:54
And just that’s why I say start with January. Get some exciting things on your calendar, and then work backwards.

Dick Hardy 6:00
I’m telling you, you know Ryan’s point that January is a primo time to for people are rethinking things. Oh, you know the whole January, New Year’s resolutions, the whole thing. Well, for some people, for some families, it will be we need to get back in church.

Dick Hardy 6:21
And that’s where we have the privilege of being able to be part of that. In all the people we come in contact with, really, September and January are golden opportunities to launch things. And so as you, as you think through December, you’re always thinking with January in mind, and always talk in January mind.

Dick Hardy 6:42
Because that intrigue, man, they’re sitting in front of you. Yeah, I know they’re sitting there for a kids program or a Christmas program, you’re doing a music or whatever, but they’re there, and that’s why you need to take a take opportunity to really talk about the great things that are happening in January.

Ryan Wakefield 6:58
Yeah, and let me throw out some ideas in December about how you do that. And Dick, you and I have been around some pastors who are masterful at this. They will have a sermon in in December, and they kind of leave it as a cliffhanger, right?

Ryan Wakefield 7:13
And now, like, part two is coming up in January, right? So they’re like, if you’re a good communicator on that, you could think through, how does my sermon leave off? Where people want to come back. They want to be in the part two. They want to finish this.

Ryan Wakefield 7:24
So, open some loops in your messages that can be closed in January. Set the stage. Obviously, we’re celebrating Christmas, but the story doesn’t end there, and that’s the exciting part. So I would say, in your sermons, in your messages, think through that.

Ryan Wakefield 7:39
In your announcement times, this may be a little bit of controversy here, but I would recommend focus more on less things. So announce fewer things, but get really good at those announcements.

Ryan Wakefield 7:52
And again, it should be pointing towards getting people back in January. And another controversial thing is I would practice your announcements, especially if you’re announcing January, more than you practice your special music.

Ryan Wakefield 8:05
Oftentimes, announcements are just throw away, and you threw the you know, youth pastor get up there and he’s winging it, and there’s really no intentionality. You spent all this time on the music, and that’s good. You should you should have good music and special windows in December.

Ryan Wakefield 8:19
But think through, man, if the whole goal is discipleship and getting people back, you’re one of your biggest opportunities is like an announcement spot. So make sure that that’s not a throwaway. Practice that, rehearse that get really good at that. And have your team watch it.

Ryan Wakefield 8:33
And then if there’s anything that you’re announcing that isn’t building towards January, consider cutting it. So, it’s like man, it’s laser focused, it’s very clear, and it’s exciting, what you want them to do so…

Dick Hardy 8:45
Oh my goodness, yeah, you’re rocking their minds when you talk about cutting things out of the service. Oh my goodness, but you’ll make it better. If you’ll do that, you’ll fine tune it. You will make it better. I’m telling you.

Ryan Wakefield 8:57
Yep. The other piece of advice I would have for you is everything that you do in December… and I would, if you want to zoom out, everything that you do as a church, not only December, but in the following year, put a priority on collecting contact information.

Ryan Wakefield 9:11
Put a priority. We call this at ChurchFuel, the law of the list, that if you want to grow a church, you got to grow your contact list. And I would almost put money on this. I know we’re not betting here, Dick, and our denomination is not a betting, gambling denomination, but I would almost put money that if you, if you double your contact list, that’s that’s going to be an indicator that you’re probably going to be doubling your church.

Ryan Wakefield 9:34
But, if a year from now, we fast forward and your contact list, your emails and mobile numbers, is the exact same, your church is going to be the exact same size. So in December, put a priority on collecting contact information, connect cards, whatever you have to do. Make it fun, do a giveaway, you know, make it meaningful.

Ryan Wakefield 9:54
Allow people to check on there maybe a local nonprofit that they can support for every Connect Card that they fill out. Well, in fact, Dick, what we have a whole pdf of 10 ideas to get people to fill out a Connect Card. So We’ll bless your audience with that as well.

Dick Hardy 10:10
Oh that’s great, thank you.

Ryan Wakefield 10:10
My people don’t fill it out. So there’s some simple ways to get them to fill it out. It’s not that hard, but do whatever you can to get people’s contact information.

Ryan Wakefield 10:20
A good friend of ours, Pastor Scotty Gibbons, who I mentored under there, would always say this: Ministry flows out of relationships. Relationships take time, and I’ve added and relationships can start when you get somebody’s contact information.

Ryan Wakefield 10:36
And so if you want to get people back in January, you got to get their contact information in December. That’s going to give you a way to get a hold of them, ideally, get their name, email and mobile number so you can text them, follow up with them, and just a little bit of a pro tip on connections…

Ryan Wakefield 10:52
Is the goal of connections… we miss this a lot. The goal of connections is not to get people to come back. And I know you’re like, Well, Ryan, you’re just telling me that you get people. Yes, but hear me out. The goal of connections is to build relationship, and out of the overflow of relationship invite people back.

Ryan Wakefield 11:08
So just don’t, don’t get people’s contact information just so you can hound them. That’s not what we’re saying. You get people’s contact information so you can get to know them, so you can pray for them, so you can minister to them, and then guess what?

Ryan Wakefield 11:19
That opens the door to invite people back in January and they’re happy to come because you’ve developed that relationship, and ministry flows out of relationship. Relationships take time. Relationships can start when you get their contact information.

Dick Hardy 11:32
You know, Ryan, it just strikes me when you’re talking about that Pat and I just took on a missionary for support, and I just got a note from them this week saying, Dick and Pat… you know, we’re, how can we pray for you this week?

Dick Hardy 11:51
Now that is not rocket science, but so few missionaries do that. So, while they’re interested in our money supporting them, they’re interested in building relationship, and they are doing that. Yep, they are doing that by asking us how they could pray for us.

Dick Hardy 12:15
That’s gold. So yeah, that’s I cannot. I cannot emphasize that more that it is about relationship. It’s not creating a bullhorn so you can blast them with everything that you’re doing. It happens more… when you think of yourself.

Dick Hardy 12:33
You know if someone who are you going to respond to, someone sends you a cold invite to something you don’t know them from Adam, or your cousin invites you, or your best friend that you just had lunch with at the rest It’s building relationship. It’s huge. It’s huge.

Ryan Wakefield 12:53
Yep, and you would be surprised. We, at ChurchFuel, we help churches run an approach we call prayer ads. Where we simply use social media and Facebook for pastors to offer to pray for people in their community.

Ryan Wakefield 13:06
And pastors are blown away of how many people in their community, near their church, just are so grateful and thankful to have a pastor praying for them. It means the world, and people are blown away, like in our communities, that you would take time to reach out and pray for me, that you care about me.

Ryan Wakefield 13:24
And pastors are just shocked, and they shouldn’t be. And so that’s why, during the holidays, people are going through a lot. There’s a lot of family difficulties, you know? There’s a lot of situations. And so that’s a perfect time to just reach out and say, Hey, how can we be praying for you?

Ryan Wakefield 13:39
You know what? And that just opens the door to keep building the relationship. And then dick, one thing, and then I know you’re I saw a light bulb go off for you there too, but I would just rally your entire church around this concept of, hey, use December to get to meet people, because it’s just not the pastor building relationship. We’re all on mission together as a congregation to be inviting in December, but encourage them that that’s not the goal.

Ryan Wakefield 14:02
The goal is that they, you know, we’re going to crowd heaven with all of these families, so all of our people who are in the core of our ministry, let’s start to think a little bit different. All of these visitors coming in December, introduce yourself, get to know them, build a relationship.

Ryan Wakefield 14:17
And then do the same thing, reach out over Christmas. How can I be praying for you? You know, in January, rally your congregation to be, you know, doing the same thing.

Ryan Wakefield 14:26
Hey, do you want to jump in and join our family with this January campaign, you know? And so if you get the entire church kind of thinking different, that’s going to give you a lot of momentum going into the New Year.

Dick Hardy 14:39
I was just with a church doing a weekend with them this past weekend, and I think you’d know the pastor, Ryan, but the the percentage of people… we did a little survey, informal anonymous survey, of the number of people that invited people to church, and it was like 65 or 70% had not invited anybody to church recently.

Dick Hardy 15:04
Well, and the reason for that is the pastor is not talking to the congregation and getting them to buy-in and and he owned it afterwards. I’m just not doing this. On that prayer subject, Ryan, I’m going to, I’m going to state what is the obvious, but when you solicit prayer needs, then you need to pray.

Dick Hardy 15:26
This is not just a hey, this is a social media deal we do. This is an email, you know, that goes out on such and such, respond to those people and then communicate publicly, obviously not the private part of a prayer need, but that you are praying, and that you have a cadre of people that are praying for those needs.

Dick Hardy 15:46
So that is genuinely going to deliver not only results for the need, but it’s going to speak to the heart of the guest.

Ryan Wakefield 15:53
Yeah, yeah. Ideally, we just coach our churches. You know, you want a pastor, a person on the prayer team, praying for that person by name and where they can hear your voice. So oftentimes, a lot of our churches do it by by phone.

Ryan Wakefield 16:07
Sometimes they do it by an audio text. Works as well, because people are busy, but people are blown away when you’re praying by for them, for their need by name and they can hear your voice, it means a lot.

Ryan Wakefield 16:18
And we know this is like one of the most important things that we can do is invite God into the biggest situations that our people in our community are facing. People are open to that. You know, even if they’re not open to come in the church, they they are really open to somebody praying for them.

Ryan Wakefield 16:33
So it’s a great middle ground. It’s a great way to get your congregation rallying, and then Dick, what I would encourage just to kind of connect your story with that pastor that was starting to see that, hey, our people aren’t inviting.

Ryan Wakefield 16:44
What we try to do at ChurchFuel, is we coach our churches to take five minutes out of their service every month and don’t just say hey, you should be inviting. Don’t even just give them like an invite card.

Ryan Wakefield 16:57
Literally lead your people during service, in a moment where you invite people right then and there. Don’t leave it up the chance. We like to use the analogy this is like your worship. It’s like, we don’t say, hey, everybody should be worshiping, here’s a song and sing it this week.

Ryan Wakefield 17:13
No, we have a worship leader that gets up that leads us all into the presence of God. And over the years, we cultivate worshipers. And it’s not surprising that, like our people know how to worship God, because we’ve cultivated that.

Ryan Wakefield 17:26
And you should do the same thing with invitation. And it’s not hard. You literally can announce, here’s what we’re doing in January, or here’s what we’re doing in December, and then say, hey, everybody, pull out your phone.

Ryan Wakefield 17:36
We’re going to put up three text messages on the screen that literally like, “Hey, I’m at Summit Park church this morning, and Pastor just announced what they’re doing this Christmas. Does your family have plans?” Question mark, hit send.

Ryan Wakefield 17:49
And then we’ll come back to that at the end of the service, you can even do the prayer idea, right? Hey, we want to use this month, we want to get everybody praying for somebody.

Ryan Wakefield 17:58
We’re going to put three text messages up on the screen and it, you know, simple thing, “hey, I’m at church, is there anything that I can be praying for you about?” Right? Hit Send.

Ryan Wakefield 18:06
And then, guess what? At the end of service, let’s have the prayer team come down front. Everybody get your phones out. Let’s go down and let’s bring those requests to God.

Ryan Wakefield 18:15
And if you do that intentionally once a month, you’re not leaving it up to chance that people would be inviting you’re literally leading your congregation, so that everybody in your church that calls your church home invites someone every single month.

Ryan Wakefield 18:31
Wouldn’t we, as pastors, we love that idea, but don’t leave it up to chance. Just say this is what we do, and we’re going to take five minutes out of a service, and we’re actually going to do it.

Ryan Wakefield 18:40
So we just think it’s cool when churches start to see every single month, every person in our congregation invites one person to church or does some sort of invitational ministry, like offering to pray for someone. And it’s so simple to do.

Dick Hardy 18:54
Well, I’m telling you when you… or at least as I think about it when people I come in contact with, now, I’m a fairly extrovertish guy, I guess.

Ryan Wakefield 19:03
Very true.

Dick Hardy 19:04
You know, I, when I meet people, I begin to learn their story, and I got one right now, a server in a restaurant, and, you know, she’s not a Christ follower at all, but it didn’t take her long…. And her her boyfriend is disabled, has a cancer stage 4. 32 years old.

Dick Hardy 19:26
Well, that’s not a church person talking to me. That’s just a real person dealing with real stuff in real life. And I’m telling you, I’ve communicated to her that we’re praying for him and and ultimately, I want to be able to present Jesus to them.

Dick Hardy 19:44
But my point is, when you talk to people, people are people, and people have needs. And the more you can do the kind of thing you’re talking about, and that is gold Ryan, to be able to actually do that in the service. Man, I wish I’d thought of that. That is just absolutely gold, and, and, and people will do it. They’ll follow the lead of the leader.

Ryan Wakefield 20:07
Yeah, especially if you encourage them and show them how, give them the tools to do it, make it easy and make it repeatable. And I think people will be shocked about how simple it is. We miss a lot of opportunities, but it’s and it’s in you can start really small.

Ryan Wakefield 20:25
So you can say, hey, we just posted an invite to what we’re doing on Christmas, or what we’re doing in January on our church’s Instagram page and Facebook page. What we’re going to do this month for five minutes.

Ryan Wakefield 20:35
Everybody, take five minutes, go to the post, share it, tag, tag somebody that’s a neighbor in the comments. You know, put it in a group if you’re if your neighborhood has a group, share it in there.

Ryan Wakefield 20:46
Like, it take five minutes, and everybody in your church just kind of got the word out. You can do really, really simple things that gets people and now, ideally, what you’re trying to train your people the light bulbs go off is, like, this is easy.

Ryan Wakefield 20:59
Like, there’s a lot of different ways that I can help be light my community, share the good news, pray for people, and oftentimes we see pastors… and I understand why, social media gets a bad rap, you know.

Ryan Wakefield 21:12
And what’s funny to me is they’ll have a missions convention on Friday, let’s go into all the world. And on Sunday, they’re bashing social media.

Ryan Wakefield 21:19
And I’m just like, hey, there’s a disconnect here. What we don’t need is people shrinking away from the mission field. We need to train our people how to be salt and light. And if you’re saying, we want to raise up missionaries, but then you’re, what you’re doing is say, but, but get off social media.

Ryan Wakefield 21:33
It’s like you’re just, you’re just sounding the retreat. And so I understand you got it there is you need to use wisdom here. Social media is not for everybody, but I do think you want to be mindful. How can we use opportunities like social media to be light in dark places?

Ryan Wakefield 21:50
And yes, it is a dark place, which is why you need light there. And I would rather a pastor think through can I lead my people to being light in the darkness rather than the light. Everybody retreat, run away and so give them simple ways to be light, as opposed to everybody just complaining about it.

Dick Hardy 22:06
Oh my, that is so good. That’s so good. Were there any, you know, kind of a parting tips or shots that you would just in your work that you’ve come across with pastors real life examples of things that have really helped pastors navigate this December, January conversation.

Ryan Wakefield 22:26
One last thing I would just encourage you to think about, I’m going to plant a seed here, not for everybody, but for somebody. This is going to help you, and if you, if you have a next step, first off, you should, as a church, you should have a very clear next step.

Ryan Wakefield 22:41
When we have a visitor, what is the one thing that we want them to do, not the 30 things, because oftentimes we just say, hey, there’s like, 50 different things, and they do nothing. It’s like the Cheesecake Factory menu. Of like, I don’t even know, just bring me something.

Ryan Wakefield 22:54
But you should have a very clear what is the one thing. And so for a lot of churches, you, you probably have done that hard work, and you hey, we’ve got a growth track, or we’ve got a membership class.

Ryan Wakefield 23:04
And this is where I would just encourage you, for a pastor that’s that’s clarified that, and you’ve got something, if it’s not working, I would encourage you to try something a little bit different.

Ryan Wakefield 23:15
You can kind of do the same thing, but call it a Welcome Party, because here’s what we found, especially if a church is reaching people who are far from God and who didn’t grow up in church, the last thing that they want to do is go to a class. Have another chore to do, have another to-do.

Ryan Wakefield 23:31
They’re not interested in learning about your church, right? So oftentimes, we hear a lot of churches come to our growth track, come learn about the church. And this is somebody’s like, you know, they’re, they’re far from God, they’re not at that place yet. But if you said, hey, we want to throw you a party.

Ryan Wakefield 23:46
We’re gonna have a Welcome Party. We want to get to know you. You know, that’s now you got somebody leaning in. So I would just, I would, I would just plant that seed, that if you’re struggling to get people to take a next step, make your next step more fun.

Ryan Wakefield 24:01
Make it a… throw a party. Hold off on the class. Throw a party in and see if more people don’t take you up and show up at your next step. So that would just be something is maybe think through as you’re planning it.

Ryan Wakefield 24:14
Maybe in January, throw a party for everybody who’s new and visited in December and see if you can’t pack a room or pack a house or pack a fellowship hall with people, and just throw them a party and see what happens.

Dick Hardy 24:27
You’ll be amazed with that. I’ve seen it done where they’ll do something simple. You’ll serve a lot, serve like a nice meal, and they’ll play Funny Games. They’ll be playing bingo at the tables, you know. So now don’t get work worked up over bingo, but you’ve got these people.

Dick Hardy 24:41
I mean, our last one that Pat and I went to for goodness sakes, we had some we had some people sitting there. And I’m telling you, these people did not fit the mold of the people that normally come to our church.

Dick Hardy 24:52
But that was beautiful, because, I mean, I’m guessing half of them, half of the two of those four didn’t know Jesus. Classes at all, but they’re there at the party because they were invited to a party, not a class. They’re invited to a party.

Dick Hardy 25:06
And by the way, I’m involved in classes that new people go to, and I did not see them at the class, but I saw them at the party. So good. Good word, Ryan, good word. Got anything else we need to cover?

Ryan Wakefield 25:19
No, I think, hopefully that gets gets people stirred up. We can put links below wherever somebody is watching this video, to the resources. Dick, I know your heart is man. We want to help the local church win. We want to reach people who are far from God. We want to crowd heaven.

Ryan Wakefield 25:34
And so I know both from Leaders.Church and us over here at ChurchFuel is if there’s anything that we can do to help you reach more people this upcoming year, we’re in and so we’ll put some links below resources for how to get people to connect cards, a kit that you can use in January.

Ryan Wakefield 25:50
We got a kit that can help you in Christmas, and we’ll just make that accessible for you guys at no cost, just to bless you and help your church win.

Dick Hardy 25:57
Ryan, thank you so much. That’s very kind, very generous of you to do and I am so grateful for our friendship over the years. To those of you who spent time watching or listening to the video or enjoying the transcript down below, thanks so much for hanging out with us. Make it a great one today and be blessed.

Jonathan Hardy 26:14
Hey, Jonathan, here real quick before you go, everything in your ministry rises and falls on your leadership, so investing in your leadership is essential to staying healthy and growing the ministry, and that’s why I want to invite you to join us inside the Leaders.Church membership, this online streaming service for pastors gives you access to more than 300 videos plus training material to level up your leadership and improve your ministry skills.

Jonathan Hardy 26:35
If you’d like to do that, I want to invite you to go to Leaders.Church/boost. Again, that’s Leaders.Church/boost. Well, thanks again for joining us on the Church Tips Podcast. We’ll look forward to seeing you next time.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

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